When an atheist hears, "not a true Christian..." 🤔
So who is anyone to say that that other person is not a quote unquote true Christian? The other difficulty I have with this phrase is, let's say that it's not being communicated about other people, but instead you're supposed to receive it about yourself and a reflection on your own behavior of whether you are or aren't a true, quote unquote true Christian
Mark-John Clifford
@markjohn · 3:15
Hi, Christina. Interesting conversation and topic, because just the other day I was meeting with some friends who are, quote unquote, quoting to them christians. And they look at it as, okay, let me give you some background. I'm a lapsed Catholic, okay. I was brought up Roman Catholic. I went to church. I did the whole thing. I was an altar boy. I've been involved in church activities
Glenn Mann
@GlennPriceMann · 3:45
So you can have to kind of have this back and forth where you're saying that this person isn't sort of living up to the ideals that I believe my faith is about
How many lessons have to be there in order to see the broader picture that it's not about the rules or the labels or who is doing which rituals, in which spaces and what labels? Did I already say that? Sorry. And instead it's about how one lives, how one loves, how someone perceives the world. And I don't understand, there's just so much judgment there
I remember going into a store, maybe November, December of last year, leading up to the holiday season, and it was a store that had a whole bunch of crafts made by people in the province, and it was really cool. But this year really stood out to me because every product that you could buy that had a quote or some saying on it had a label of some sort, teacher, dad, mom, sister, artist, whatever it was
Missy Jones
@lemrjane · 0:21
It. That's right, hon. The only thing is, people can't communicate with other people good enough to see if they have a good heart or not a good heart or whatever it is that there is. Basically, it just boils down to evil versus good
I feel like I wanted to say preach. There's not enough listening, not enough observing, not enough sitting back and receiving, and instead a whole hell of a lot of broadcasting and judgment, finger pointing, et cetera, without actually understanding or even seeking to understand somebody. And we are all guilty of that at some point or another
Glenn Mann
@GlennPriceMann · 1:43
I think a lot of what we determine as religious fighting or religious is just a proxy for culture and ego. And I think a lot of times it's very easy to hide behind the label of religion when you don't want to deal with people who are different from you or believe different from you or have a different way of looking at the world or wanting to operate. So I think it's very easy
I love this. That's it. That's all I've got to say. I just really appreciated this. Thank you
Missy Jones
@lemrjane · 0:12
Carl. That is so true. So true. Mind my husband. He's down there hollering at the dogs because they are not minding today. They want to play
Erica Jean
@HeyItsErica · 4:07
Hey, Christina, thank you for posting this. Thank you. Thank you. I've also re swelled it. What is a true Christian, and why do christians say this? I still don't have an answer. And I am a believer. I still don't have an answer. It's like you said, a lot of christians, they told a lie while looking the other way when they should be focused in a different direction
It's interesting, too, when I think about this and the things that you were talking about, too, about who can and can't, quote unquote say anything about whatever I've heard that said to me, because I'm not a parent, so I can't talk about anything related to children. I've heard it said about relationships because I'm not in a relationship at the moment, like, whatever it might be, right?
Isiah Smith
@isiah · 3:16
It's so interesting. It's something I've been thinking about for a while, for a really long time, actually, just in terms of things in general that we hear on a regular basis. In this case, it's Christianity. And it's just one of those things where in order for the concept of Christianity to exist, there must at least be the judgment of what it is and what it is not. There ought to be true Christianity. Right?
And anything that doesn't match that criteria is not Christianity. Right. And I'm making that distinction for a few reasons, because logically, I can get behind a lot of what you're saying. But practically, how do we apply that when there are so many nuances and complexities to Christianity itself, from the translations of the original languages to how the Bible was determined, which books to go in it and the order of them, to the way that it was translated?
J.L. Beasley
@Her_Sisu · 4:14
To just state it plainly, I am a spiritual Christian or not state it at all and just say, I am focused on spirituality. Spirituality is important to me. That way there's no distinguishing of me versus them, they versus them or any of that. And then potentially putting others who are hearing me say this in the space of, wait a minute, I am a devout Christian
And whenever we start making these statements of I'm this and not that, I think some of it falls along those lines of not wanting to be lumped in with certain groups and then elevating and demoting different groups. And again, I've said this to somebody else. This is not solely a christian thing that's being done. Right. You see this throughout culture of not a true fill in the blank. And we're sort of creating the insecurities with ourselves
Even when you talk about the faiths that are like the muslim faith or whether it's the catholic faith or the jewish faith, it's kind of like, why are you like this? Why are you so rigid and authoritative and totalitarianism? It brings into it, it reminds me of another quote that I hate, especially if it's set in the hurtful, harmful, intended to and hurt context is soul searching. You better do some soul searching, or you know what I mean?
It does. I don't often talk about this publicly because it doesn't always go over very well. But for all of the talk and references to Christianity being about God is love, there's a lot of verses, a lot of language that makes it anything but. And you can't help but get wrapped up in it and be judgmental
Erica Jean
@HeyItsErica · 3:14
But the one thing they did teach is that Adam and Eve were not the first, but perhaps in a particular area. Those two humans, whether you believe God created them or what may have you, those two humans were there. They procreated, and maybe they were the ones who sinned or fell short. When I was in college, I took a class that was called religion and science, how they don't have to be divorced. Religion and science can work together
Right? And so trying to nail down any sort of this is what Christianity is, and this is not what Christianity is. And you can have a room on clubhouse, for example, full of christians, and they can all argue over a single verse and what it means. We've even seen arguments happen here on swell. So I don't know. It's difficult. And I'm not saying that there should be a one size fits all, this is what Christianity is
Oh, I forgot to mention, I included a link there to an interesting. I had never heard of these people. Apparently the anunnaki is how it's pronounced, and they were supposedly gods from the sky that had come. These are written about in the sumerian tablets or something, and it's a different creation story, a different. The interpretations that were made in the
Erica Jean
@HeyItsErica · 3:11
And the fact that I realize that it's my foundation doesn't mean that I can't agree with other truths that I come across. So I think that's what sets me and people like me apart from the over religious. So, yeah, this is great
To me, that is the enriching experience of discovery, of exploration, of learning. And I love that richness of that entire process. And running across somebody else when they are doing this in whatever arena they're doing, it is just a joy to observe, to witness, no pun intended, but it really fit. And I just really appreciate that your approach to your journey
Chris Gritti
@InteGritti · 1:58
So not a true Christian, in and of itself as a statement, has no logic in it. It's just judgment. It's just tribal othering. Boy, I ramble ADHD, too. He
I really liked this answer, this perspective. It really kind of opened me up to some thinking of something else. I really like this. Thank you
And although he's describing it from an autistic perspective, I think this can also apply to just about a lot of different neurodivergent people. And maybe not strictly neurodivergent, but it's very much about one's perspectives or opinions, or relating one to another, being apart from those hierarchies and virtue signaling and judgments and so on
L A
@homosanity · 5:00
This happened in the Old Testament too. One of the biggest concerns was false prophets, false teachers, false teaching, and then that producing mass followers and believers, that really mixed up the teachings into all sorts of things that just were not really true to what Christianity was about or what Judaism was about. So you could have people saying, for instance, in the New Testament there were people saying, hey, you have to be circumcised and you can't do this and you can't do that
L A
@homosanity · 3:42
But like I said, I'm not really involved too much into organized religion because of it just hasn't changed in years and years and years and years and years. There's actually a book I'm going to buy called the Nuns and the Nuns. N-O-N-E-S-I did a podcast on this. Are actually, we are no longer a christian nation. We are a nuns nation. The group of nuns, atheist, agnostics and people who are spiritual but not religiously affiliated are the largest group in America now
Like, if we go back to the scriptures and look at what was a prophet, what was a heretic, and somehow look at those definitions and those understandings in the culture and the language of the times and compare it then to who and is being described as a quote unquote false Christian or not a quote unquote true Christian
L A
@homosanity · 4:56
And yeah, it is a shame that here we have something that has a message that's counterposed to those kind of things, and it doesn't necessarily get across to everybody, but it doesn't mean that the whole of the faith is following along with that. I think that people who do do that just from my experience, are doing it in a way of, and this is just my experience, but are doing it in the way of sometimes maturity, like you're saying
It's almost like individually it will point fingers at you. But when it comes to movements or groups of christians that are doing things that are counter to what the faith is or what a particular belief or stance is, we're just going to let you continue to carry the label. You know what I mean?
L A
@homosanity · 5:00
I know, for instance, I could give tons of examples, but I'm just thinking of a recent one, which I don't know that it's a very good example, but at the small church that I go to, we had a man there who played in the worship, sang, and he
L A
@homosanity · 2:54
You. And I kind of wondered that too. People would say, well, if your religion is really peaceful and you're against these terrorists, you need to speak out about it. And it really wasn't. You saw some things, but not a lot. But I thought later, on the other hand, you're never really going to stop those people. You really won't
I'll leave it at that. And if anything was done, it being either brushed under the carpet or done behind closed doors, because heaven forbid, sorry, no pun, intended, it would have a negative consequences for the reputation of the church. And I almost think that addressing some of this more publicly is important because there's already plenty of Christians who don't want to be associated with the word Christian. Right?
